Proposal for consistent message!

[StephenRGallagher]

I would like to open for discussion the oppotunity to clearly state who we are:


"Legally recognized recreational vehicles"



If we use the above terminology it does not matter what state you are in or what definition the state uses.


In NH:

If on a public right of way, on highway, we are"Legally Recognized" as NH registered and inspected vehicles traveling on back roads.

If on private property with landowner permisison we are "Legally Recognized" as authorized recreatrional users.

If on State trails and a sticker program is implemented down the road then we would be" Legally Recognized" as NH stickered OHRV.


In any other state regardless of what the state definition is for the terrain a member would legally travel, they would be "Legally Recognized" for the class they are in.


Post your comments and come up with a solid platform to call ourselves!

[tammylynn]

Well my first comment would be that "legally" omits those vehicles in our group which cannot become legally registered or inspected.

[jacodi]

I see 2 things.
On Class 6 roads and other public highways and legally registered and inspected we are motor vehicles.

On private land, whether registered and inspected or just registered or none, we are Off Highway Recreational Vehicles. Because we are off highway.

Whatever we choose to call 'ourselves', we need to be consistant.

[Scott Hatch]

OHRV off a public way

Motor Vehicle while on a Public way

[tammylynn]

I guess I don't understand why we need one message because we obviously have two different audiences here. Why can't we have two different definitions that relate to the audience we are approaching? Then no matter what state you are working in you can use the same definitions.

We are an off-highway recreational vehicle. We operate a vehicle off of the road/pavement/highway. The majority of our members do not build their vehicles for the purpose of driving down the street. I know Class VI Roads are roads but not by a normal definition. Most of them are dirt roads with obstacles-IMO a trail. Way back in 1914 when the road was actually a road it probably did serve it's purpose but when you drive some of these now you begin to realize time and mother nature have changed the classification of some of these supposed roads.

The problem I am having is that I think we are confusing the issue. Scott was talking about the work we are doing in NH, with NH state agencies, regarding NH laws and statutes. He brought this info to the NH Land Committee and we worked together at a meeting to come up with a pretty good definition and now all of a sudden we have turned this into something I don't think it is. This is a NH Land Committee project. The mission of the Association still defines who we are as a whole. I guess I feel that we have built a solid platform but that platform has to allow for flexibility depending on who we are communicating with. Look in the dictionary. Most words have more than one meaning.

[StephenRGallagher]

My intention is not to create turmoil but come up with a consistent message that applies across the board.

"Legally recognized" does not infer that you have to be legally registered.

What it infers that the state legally recognizes the fact that when you are off highway you are classifies as an OHRV and when you are on HIGHWAY you must be legally registered. The State would "Legally recognize" that we are meeting the state standards of classification:

Motor Vehicle while traveling on Roads
OHRV while traveling off roads.


Why do we need this? maybe in your oppninion you see no need for a consistent message. Maybe you have not had the Landowner with the bad taste in his mouth from the word OHRV. Maybe you really could care less. I don't know but I know from my many conversations with Land owners, Farmers, Loggers, and generaly well to do land owners the term OHRV sours them.

OHRV to many landowners puts a vision of Quads, Dirt bikes, and beer drinking renegades. The explanation process is a lot easier when you can point out the great things that have been accomplished and the great work that can be accounted to the many hours of hard work, put in by many people over the past twenty years. Landowners tend to be more receptive to a term of "legally recognized". This simple phrase puts a flavor of law abiding citizens looking to have responsible recreational activities.

The term changes nothing of the status of your vehicel and segregates no one. a simple term to be used in correspondance and on the web.


The Northeast Association of 4WD Clubs inc. is happy to announce that we are actively pursuing a sticker program for our "Legally Recognized" recreational vehicles. We have put many years of hard work and dedication as well as public education into creating an atmosphere where the renegade OHRV operators have been enlightened to respect the land owner rights. To practice conservation efforts, practice Tread Lightly programs and promote Legally Recognized responsible recreation.

The NEA is recognized by the State of New Hampshire Fish and Game and was instrumental in getting the Safety Patrol up and running. The safety Patrol put Legally recognized recreational enthusiasts out on public trails, private trails and state roads educating and promoting responsible recreation.

The NEA has achieved some great landowner-associaiton relationships. Working with land managers and private landowners opening up access to many hundreds of acres of private land available to Legally recognized recretaional vehicles and their operators. None of which would have been possible with out foresight dedication and ambition to educate and promote responsible recreation on and off road. For more information Please visit www.nea4wd.org

[Scott Hatch]

I understand you Stephen but I don't agree with the term you are proposing.

I agree we need a consistant message.

I think there is a better term out there similiar to ATV or something to refer to our sport, I'm just not agreeing that the term you're proposing is the best.

My posts are often quick as I'm in between doing work at work and my previous post wasn't completed.

I know at the NH STAC meetings I am the 4x4 rep

We used to be able to ourselves 4 wheelers and state that we were going 4-wheeling but now people think ATV

[StephenRGallagher]

LRMV= Legally recognized motor vehicle


OHV, OHRV, ATV, 4x4 etc is all too mixed and confused!


There is no confusion to the fact that we are Motor Vehicles!

Do any of you disagree with this?

Do any of you disagree that we are recretaional vehicles?

Do any of you disagree that the state has already classified differnet categories for what to be called?

Do any of you disagree that the term OHRV is very broad and very bitter to many people!

This has been a good conversation! Wish more people would participate!

[Mikey]

what definition do they use out west? (thinking of their green sticker deal-e-o)

[Treasurer]

I think we are a self-propelled high clearance 4 wheel drive vehicle. The high clearnace terminology is borrowed from the BLM. For all you electircal geeks a motor implies we run on electricity. I could not resisit that statement. I learned something in Naval Electrcian's Mate A school.

[mrfreakinwhite]

Here's something to chew on, Stephen. In the state of MA, there are state forests that allow the use of ATVs. They do not allow the use of anything over 1,000lbs on those designated trails.

The Wildlife Management Areas allow the use of 4x4s on the "roads" but disallow them to turn off onto any "trails." I honestly do not know if ATVs get registered here or what. I do know that the "trails" are banned to any motorized vehicle.

I'm unsure of how mass could come to adopt ATVs and 4x4s under one heading of LRMV. I mean, a sticker program for this state would be great, but there seems to be some division even among the legal ATV riders and the legal 4x4 drivers.

So, I'm typing/thinking out loud, if we broadened our perspective a little bit and tried to join forces with the ATVs under one unified voice, maybe one that already exists and also to include our friends with big buggies we could identify our rides as the legally recognized motor vehicles from that point on? Is this kinda what you're thinking?

[StephenRGallagher]

To be honest with you, I am not so sure I would agree with rolling ATV memberships into the NEA and think it would be detriment to the existence of the NEA and the land access.

That having been said, those users groups are already designated and labeled and have laws regarding them. I am not opposed to working together on issues that effect both user groups but it is not a focus area I would want ot go into.

LRMV already encompasses the buggies and the trailer queens. They would be "legally recognized" as OHV's while on private property providing they have permisison.

If they do not have legal permisison then they would be a renegade wheeler and not an LRMV!

Thanks for the comments!

[ToxicTurtle]

2 cents from south of the border....

Although I agree with Steve that it would be great to have ONE term to qualify us no matter where we were traveling, I think it would only work amongst ourselves. and even then, only those who are truly active... A new perspective member visits the site and sees Legally Recognized Motor Vehicle... what is JQ ignorant Public going to think. Anything that is a legally recognized motor vehicle? In NH, what are legally recognized motor vehicles? A quad is legally recognized, so is a motorcycle and obviously, so are full sized 4x4s.

Case in point. Call the state of CT and ask them about a Legally Recognized Motor Vehicle. They will ask you if you are refering to a registered and insured motor vehicle or an ATV. Well... yes and no. Some trucks are reg/ins'd, buggy types aren't. Heck, there are some people who are driving rigs that could easily be reg/ins'd and aren't "buggyesque" at all but they choose not to reg/ins and trailer their rigs to events.
Also, in MA and CT, ATVs and Motorcycles would also be considered legally recognized motor vehicles. One can register and insure a dirt bike as long as it has lights, etc. One MUST register an ATV. In CT, an ATV is defined as any motor vehicle that one straddles... that includes motorcycles. Quads, even when registered, can not be driven on any town roads.
So, in answer to the state's question... One still must explain what we mean.

Out west, much is run by the federal gov't and all of the states have fallen into their terminoligy... That makes it very easy. Out west we ALL are OHVs : Off Highway Vehicles. ATVs, MX bikes, snowmobiles, sand rails, full sized 4x4s, those new UTVs.. (they aren't a quad but they aren't a truck either.. they weigh more than 1000 lbs...) and OHVs can go wherever the maps say OHVs can go. OHV trails. There are segregated trails out there as well and they will be designated by the picture signs. If all OHVs are allowed to operate on a trail, then, one will see all vehicles with out the red circle. If any type of OHV is not allowed, it simply has the red circle around it.
OHV does really quantify what we are driving. or possibly Off Pavement Vehicle... maybe Off Pavement Motor Vehicle..

However, we are NOT out west and must deal with the fact that here in New England, each state has chosen to work independantly of each other and create their own laws based only roughly on what they like from another state.

In CT right now, we are working VERY closely with the state, and fellow motorized users, both quad and bike. We have come to grips with the fact that the state will NOT see us as one group. We are currently working to get land set aside for ATV/MX riding but at the same time we are working with the state to designate 4x4 roads on state lands that are more difficult than a graded dirt road. We have started using the terminology "full sized 4x4" for the state to understand what we are talking about.

The unfortunate fact is that each state has its own terms and laws for public roads, trails, private lands, trucks, cars, quads, etc. and we, as the people who are at the forefront of these issues, need to be aware of how the states feel and even how an individual landowner may feel and use terms that work for that particular situation. If we can move towards that one designation, we should try to work at it.. however, I still feel that it will be on a state by state basis.

hhhmmm... I think you got about 3 cents worth...

Talk soon,

[mrfreakinwhite]

I agree that ATVs and 4x4s are seperate user groups, but wanted to understand what you meant. Thank you. I also agree that land owners perceive ATVs differently than 4x4s - some say Jeeps rip it up while some say dirt bikes or quads rip it up.

[Scott Hatch]

LRMV= Legally recognized motor vehicle


OHV, OHRV, ATV, 4x4 etc is all too mixed and confused!


There is no confusion to the fact that we are Motor Vehicles!

Do any of you disagree with this?

Do any of you disagree that we are recretaional vehicles?

Do any of you disagree that the state has already classified differnet categories for what to be called?

Do any of you disagree that the term OHRV is very broad and very bitter to many people!

This has been a good conversation! Wish more people would participate!

The term OHRV is a broad, all encompassing definition by which the state of NH classifies all motorized users. This broad definition is similiar to most states where all motorized users have one broad definition and then breaks down different individual motorized users. MA calls them OHVs as well as most other states and the Forest Service.

The term that used is conditional upon the situation, take for example Endro Bikes. They are street registered and registered as an Trail Bike OHRV.

I do agree that we should discuss a term for our sport but I disagree with the term "legally recognized motor vehicle". To me this is really no different that OHRV as it is a broad definition which can describe any motorized recreational user.

[Paul]

Hey, didn't read all this and dunno if it applies but, check this, got all the clubs Tread Lightly literature in today and they use the term "HCV"


High Clearance Vehicle


me likey.

[Treasurer]

Wait that is a term I sued earlier in this thread. I said High Clearance 4 Wheel Drive Vehicle. The BLM uses this terminology on their literatrure and signs. The trails I drove on in Nevada I could have done in a old front wheel drive Subaru. We still need to use the terminolgy that is popular with each different state to communicate with said state.